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strychnine
Advanced Member
Australia
2,268 posts
Joined: Feb, 2002
92 hardcore releases
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 Posted - 2002/12/10 : 13:13:49
quote:
Originally posted by Soren:
I'm sure you went up to people and said:
"Hi, I'm Viv from Mixmag. Mixmag has been bashing HHC for years and years. We called you all childish, we said your music sucks, and we put down your scene in every creative way we could. But now we put out a HHC CD and said HHC is cool again. Do you like us?"
And not something more like:
"Hi, Mixmag is totally behind you guys, why we even put a Brisk CD on our Mag to prove it! Isn't that great?"
Anyone that doesn't remember what you've said in the past (which is most people cause of the turnover rate in the "rave" scene) won't be upset with you. Especially if you slant your view and the reality of the situation. Which I'm 100% positive you did if everyone liked you.
I'm 100% positive that any reasonable person would've done the same thing under the circumstances. Be realistic here, is it all that smart to introduce yourself by reference to past actions that the person(s) in front of you may perceive to be sins against themselves or their kind? No, it probably isn't.
What Viv did may not have been entirely honest, but it was forward-looking. This is a perspective that I think more people on this board should try out sometime.
quote:
I've decided that you're just a bunch of childish arseholes.
Ummm ... here's where I kinda disagree with Viv. Sure (as Nick said) there are some in this thread who've adopted a somewhat less-than-mature attitude about it, but there has been some semi-intelligent discussion going on. Give us some credit here.
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Underloop
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
3,895 posts
Joined: Mar, 2002
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Posted - 2002/12/11 : 00:52:16
quote:
I've decided that you're just a bunch of childish arseholes.
Professional journalism at it's finest!
Matthew aka DJ Underloop
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"Turn that shit up!!!!!"
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"We don't stop playing because we grow old;
we grow old because we stop playing."
- George Bernard Shaw
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Viv @ Mixmag
New Member
United Kingdom
21 posts
Joined: Nov, 2002
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Posted - 2002/12/11 : 02:53:44
well, I can't win. If I try and argue reasonably, we end up in a slanging match, and if I slag people off I get told I'm not being grown up enough.
so i think the slagging off option is better because then at least I don't just get to take abuse... and it's more fun
Olighalebi - yeah, email our clubs ed [email protected] with the details of the night - sounds good
ps. love u all really
pps. still no comments on Mixmag doing a hardcore cover? Where's the bile and vitriol gone?
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James D
Senior Member
United Kingdom
344 posts
Joined: Oct, 2002
76 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2002/12/11 : 04:06:11
the fact that you cant win is the first thing we truly agree on.
the hypocricy of the magazine, if not you personally, will not sit well with most hardcore ravers.
; )
i do, however, find your sarcastic tone to be quite amusing.
'ps. love u all really
pps. still no comments on Mixmag doing a hardcore cover? Where's the bile and vitriol gone?'
i actually did laugh at this
: )
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have you got some of this hardcore power?
let the bass beat louder....
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Underloop
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
3,895 posts
Joined: Mar, 2002
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Posted - 2002/12/11 : 04:30:28
quote:
well, I can't win. If I try and argue reasonably, we end up in a slanging match, and if I slag people off I get told I'm not being grown up enough
I'd go with slagging people off, then you can be a childish arsehole like the rest of us 
As for a mixmag hardcore cover.... go for it. Everyone seems to be worried about Mixmag basically raping the scene and leaving it for dead. For that to happen, people must get sick of the scene and leave it... hands up all those who are going to leave the scene once Mixmag has finished with it!!! Anybody?? C'mon, there must be at least one corporate whore ready to leech off the latest fashionable music (present company excluded Viv  ). OK, well in that case, I'd suggest we all sit back and enjoy the ride.
If Viv wants to run hardcore articles in Mixmag, then I doubt if we are going to stop it. Sure, everyone loves the scene, and we're all very protective of it, but its because of that love that I know hardcore can never be destroyed. Sure, theres been bleak times (post mixmag), but we came through it, and if it happens again we can do it again. If anything it made the scene stronger... it sorted out the true hardcore from the rest, coz they stood by the scene, whilst the rest dissappeared over to other genres.
To Viv I would ask this. If you like hardcore like you say you do, then go easy. Even if you won't apologise for the slating your magazine has given hardcore over the past number of years, at least give us respect now. Less of the cheap insults about the music, the way we dress, the way we act etc. We have fun, and thats what music/clubbing/going out is all about. We don't hurt anybody else, so don't try and hurt us with cheap jibes (I'm talking aboutin the magazine, not about calling us all childish arseholes  )
Yes, the article about hardcore was well written, and the CD was good, thank you. I enjoyed it.
So anyway, what I'm really trying to say is, if your not going to do what everybody is saying you will do then go for it with the Hardcore cover..... but remember, you don't want to be proved wrong by a bunch of childish arseholes!!!!
Matthew aka DJ Underloop
--------------------------
"Turn that shit up!!!!!"
__________________________________
"We don't stop playing because we grow old;
we grow old because we stop playing."
- George Bernard Shaw
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Edited by - Underloop on 2002/12/11 04:33:48 |
Soren
Senior Member
United States
499 posts
Joined: Mar, 2001
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Posted - 2002/12/11 : 07:31:10
Strychnine:
quote:
I'm 100% positive that any reasonable person would've done the same thing under the circumstances. Be realistic here, is it all that smart to introduce yourself by reference to past actions that the person(s) in front of you may perceive to be sins against themselves or their kind? No, it probably isn't.
I agree, I was just pointing out that Viv's claim that all the HHC kiddies liked her or whatever was based on them not knowing what's "going down". Now I know you feel the need to argue with absolutely everything I say no matter how wrong you are, but c'mon that's just getting silly. You knew where I was coming from and what I was talking about......
quote:
What Viv did may not have been entirely honest, but it was forward-looking. This is a perspective that I think more people on this board should try out sometime
So we should talk all the sh%t we want about people, hide the truth of matters to make oursleves seem better, and sleight the past so that people like us better? And as long as they don't know about it it's cool to be friendly with them in an attemt to profit off of them? And then we become better people? I agree, rockin' philosophy on life, I'll get started straight away!
Everyone stop being honest so that you can be "forward looking"! It totally rocks! Telling the truth is for suckers. Get with the now, c'mon everyone else is doing it!
Viv:
quote:
well, I can't win. If I try and argue reasonably, we end up in a slanging match,
You never addressed any of the isues people raised while at the same time portraying an extremely arrogant attitude. What did you expect? Are we owed an appology or not? Do you think Mixmags attitude and past actions entitle us to be upset at all? Will Mixmag appologize or just continue with it's hypocritical "support" of HHC?
quote:
and if I slag people off I get told I'm not being grown up enough.
You have to see that you represent Mixmag, and Mixmag has slandered the scene in the past. If you aren't going to say something nice then you should be very careful of what you say if you want people to be nice. From my (and I think others) perspective you started out in the wrong. And hence you were given an opportunity to make up for past wrongs and you gave it up. Instead you go off on rants about how we are facists and childish. If you aren't going to be civil, print an appology, or keep your mouth shut of course people are going to get pissy with you. Do you think because we like HHC we have to be nice to people that are rude to us?
quote:
so i think the slagging off option is better because then at least I don't just get to take abuse... and it's more fun
Poor you. Taking all that abuse. Look, you need to grow up. Either print an appology or don't, I really don't care anymore. But if you aren't then you'll get no respect from me or many others in the HHC scene. That's just the way it is. If you enjoy sitting around and insulting people instead of just swallowing your amazingly huge ego and printing an appology cause "It's more fun" then you are welcome. After all this IS a socialist board.
quote:
ps. love u all really
Cool. I'm not mad at you or anything in case that's what you think. I realize that you weren't the one that wrote the articles in the past and I realize that you just became the editor or whatever. I do think you took this issue way to personally when it wasn't meant to be. I also think you have represented yourself in a rather poor manner while not acting as a representative for Mixmag as you should have. But honestly, who cares anymore? Not me. I keep responding cause I amazed at the slant that you are trying to put on this issue instead of just frikkin' appologizing or letting the thread die. It seems very weird. Maybe you're one of those "Only happy when it rains" people. Whatever.
quote:
pps. still no comments on Mixmag doing a hardcore cover? Where's the bile and vitriol gone?
Oh, you're doing a HHC cover? Are you going to appologize? If not then I personally will not buy the HHC Mixmag or any future issues and will encourage others to do the same. That's the absolute worst I can do. If you take that into consideration and still print a HHC cover then good luck to you cause I highly doubt that all the trancer/houser club kiddies are ready to embrace HHC and I think it'll hurt your sales.
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Happy Hardcore makes me feel like a Koala bear just crapped a rainbow in my brain.
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Edited by - Soren on 2002/12/11 10:39:15 |
strychnine
Advanced Member
Australia
2,268 posts
Joined: Feb, 2002
92 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2002/12/11 : 11:26:15
quote:
Originally posted by Soren:
I agree, I was just pointing out that Viv's claim that all the HHC kiddies liked her or whatever was based on them not knowing what's "going down".
And what do you suggest instead - that Viv sit down with these kids and tell them what Mixmag used to publish about hardcore? Please.
quote:
Now I know you feel the need to argue with absolutely everything I say no matter how wrong you are, but c'mon that's just getting silly.
The only reason that I feel the need to argue with you is because I generally disagree with what you're saying. Simply put, you criticise Viv for doing what any reasonable person would've done in her shoes.
quote:
Everyone stop being honest so that you can be "forward looking"! It totally rocks! Telling the truth is for suckers. Get with the now, c'mon everyone else is doing it!
Yep. That's exactly what I suggest, and it's something that I live by. You should try it sometime.
Honestly mate, I really can't convince myself that you're in any way wrong or mistaken in adopting the stance that you have - only naive, maybe a little misguided. And sure as hell I think it's too moralistic, but that's just my opinion. *shrugs*
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Oli G
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United States
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Joined: Oct, 2001
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Posted - 2002/12/11 : 12:10:11
i brand this topic...
OFFICIAL TOPIC TO HAVE MOST QUOTES PER POST
OFFICIAL TOPIC TO HAVE LONGEST REPLYS :D
CAM001 Out FEB2003
Distribution Through Nu Energy & Imo
www.camelrecords.co.uk
\o/ <o/ \o> <o> /o\ _o/ \o_
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Stevie c
Advanced Member
Belgium
3,836 posts
Joined: Dec, 2002
204 hardcore releases
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 Posted - 2002/12/12 : 00:51:22
I agree, Mixmag is pretending its always been into the underground, I remember a copy that had an alphebet of dance music and Hardcore came under A for 'Ardcore;Presenting in some wy we were all stupid, Maybe they are under new management since then but I still feel like they are the fly by night friend. I did like the get rid of the old Dj's article though, Lets see if one they stick to their promise and two weather they include Hardcore Djs in that, The cd is banging and I think sampling the balerics is a good idea, I am going to try it tomorrow night at my first dance gig, Crapping myself or what!!
stevie c
Your into the sound of Rebeliion
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Soren
Senior Member
United States
499 posts
Joined: Mar, 2001
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Posted - 2002/12/12 : 04:05:27
quote:
And what do you suggest instead - that Viv sit down with these kids and tell them what Mixmag used to publish about hardcore? Please.
Again, I wasn't suggesting anything. I was simply pointing out her comment was based on people not knowing the truth. That's it. She skewed her background to gain support and then came her to proclaim that she gained support to back up her statement that we were "childish" and stupid or whatever. It's fine you think it's cool to lie to people and deceive them, and if other people agree with you then cool, but I was just pointing out that that's what she was doing. I wasn't making any kind of judgement because i think it'd be a little redundant to point out her personal flaws in this issue. Plus it'd only piss her off more.
quote:
The only reason that I feel the need to argue with you is because I generally disagree with what you're saying. Simply put, you criticise Viv for doing what any reasonable person would've done in her shoes.
That's just my point, she's not reasonable. No reasonable person should lie, deceive, and be so ignorant. And if everyone in the world is like that and that's the way you're supposed to be then we all deserve to die in a horrible horrible way cause everyone is just a waste of space.
""if you have no respect for yourself, you'll have no respect for others." and visa versa.
quote:
Honestly mate, I really can't convince myself that you're in any way wrong or mistaken in adopting the stance that you have - only naive, maybe a little misguided. And sure as hell I think it's too moralistic, but that's just my opinion. *shrugs*
Honestly I don't think you're wrong either. I just think that a great part of humanity has your values (or lack there of) and I think it needs to change. The world is an overpopulated angry place and rich ignorant people shouldn't be adding to the misery for their own personal gain when they already have 500X more crap then everyone else on the planet. Sure this Mixmag thing isn't going to change the world, but it's a damn fine representation of power gone wrong.
On a side note I wish I didn't have morals, it'd make my life a lot easier. Any suggestions on how to get rid of them in a non painful way? I also wish I was ignorant of the world cause ignorance is bliss, or so they say.
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Happy Hardcore makes me feel like a Koala bear just crapped a rainbow in my brain.
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Happy Hardcore makes me feel like a Koala bear just crapped a rainbow in my brain.
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strychnine
Advanced Member
Australia
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Joined: Feb, 2002
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Posted - 2002/12/12 : 12:07:31
quote:
On a side note I wish I didn't have morals, it'd make my life a lot easier. Any suggestions on how to get rid of them in a non painful way? I also wish I was ignorant of the world cause ignorance is bliss, or so they say.
Mess up your karma and get reincarnated as a daffodil or something ... I dunno, mine were torn away from me in a series of unpleasant interactions with the rest of the world that convinced me that no matter what, somebody will always get f***ed, and that I didn't wanna be that somebody anymore.
There is no right and wrong anymore for me - everything's just another shade of grey, and the whether your actions are right or wrong hinges not on some sense of natural values, but on how well you can spin your actions to other people. In my mind, therefore, Viv and the rest of Mixmag are only doing what I'd expect anybody else to do.
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mcjutt
Advanced Member
United Kingdom
564 posts
Joined: Jul, 2002
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Posted - 2002/12/12 : 21:12:39
so viv about thst position my love?
get with my lyrics il make u sweat
im a bad boy mc youll never forget
the quickest mc u evr met
all my competion get set for a rough ride u cant even touch my vibe where all the raving crew tonight
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Stevie c
Advanced Member
Belgium
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Joined: Dec, 2002
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 Posted - 2002/12/12 : 23:52:14
Well, Well we sit and enjoy watching progessive and hardhouse die on its feet and look who comes crawling back, HELLO Mixmag!! the establishment, ministry loving,cord wearing afro funkster trying to re-discover its edge and roots. No longer able to talk about IBIZA all the time they have come unstuck, thinking all hardcore ravers must have grown up and disappeared they try to apeal to the new youth, one problem, some of us are still here and we were never saying how good it was in the old days cos you were to busy trying to make them rubbish for us!! I was at Universe 93 and remember D:REAM playing the house tent, lets face it when you music is used by the labour party you well and truely f$$ked!! ahahahahahahahaha!!!
You never liked us cos you were to busy trying to look cool instead of being it!! Our glow sticks costumes and fun cover IBIZA and its that attitude people want! You had to accept Jungle because it became an ethic music (harsh but true) now you need something new,back you crawl, to steal and boost sales!! Well perhaps you have learnt your lesson but I doupt it, You think Danny Rampling is past it? WRONG!! He should never have been there in the first place!! Just a happy hardcore dj with no balls!! Are our costumes annoying because we actually remember free festivals and warehouse parties?oris it a desire of designer label to control your music?
Anyway were not back we never went away (although a lot of the cd owes the baleric sound a handshake) and i never want to grow up if it means wear shirts and trousers with special names to a club.
Mixmag show us your serious and rotate the style of genre every issue, Yes that means Trance, Garage, House, Jungle, Hardcore, Gabba, Leftfield, Techno and all the sub-divisons within them. I don't like them all but do believe as an original ruffneck badboy old skool raver that each of the scenes should be treated by the press with equal effect!! Of course this won't happen, Radio one will be playing Hardcore for the breakfast show before some w$$kers come around!! To realize beating the Criminal Justice Act and the anti-terroist laws means unity, whatever the beat you dance too!!
We live as one family!!!
Sweet Harmony!!
Stevie 'white gloves' C
Your into the sound of Rebeliion
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mcjutt
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United Kingdom
564 posts
Joined: Jul, 2002
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Posted - 2002/12/13 : 00:02:13
well its like this there expanding there horizons on the scene no we dont expect them to be ravers, but there seeing a good thing come through and bsiclly whos gonna stop them what vivs trying to say is we have slated hardcore yes but were discovering its new found sound and there just letting people know about its change and dawn of an era so give em credit and leave the ****ing argueing and plus if there letting peeps now about it HAS to be a good thing
get with my lyrics il make u sweat
im a bad boy mc youll never forget
the quickest mc u evr met
all my competion get set for a rough ride u cant even touch my vibe where all the raving crew tonight
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Shammmmmmmmmmmooooooooooone
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strychnine
Advanced Member
Australia
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Joined: Feb, 2002
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Posted - 2002/12/13 : 01:17:30
Stevie C: I have nothing further to contribute to this thread ATM but I'd just like to point out that that's a farkin' big-ass paragraph that there reply o' yours 
And now for a random funny emoticon:  <=== Go monkey, Go monkey, Go!
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