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Glow_Stixy
New Member
United Kingdom
44 posts
Joined: Jun, 2001
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 Posted - 2001/06/26 : 16:47:56
i dont thinks its fair how especially the british media (i dont know any other e.gs) make such a big deal over the drug issue - especially when it comes to E's - leah bets werent it - only one pill - made a martyr from poppin one pill - yet the thousands of children and adults dieing from alcohol and fags are rarely mentioned as it seems its such a 'low-key' issue to them. i dont do pills, but i do smoke pot - i think the laws are so f*cked over the whole issue - but can do nothing - as can none of the people in our culture can do anything to attack at the top or have our voices heard - we are the lost generation.
a.gray
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a.gray
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aznwasian
Senior Member
United States
428 posts
Joined: Jun, 2001
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Posted - 2001/06/26 : 19:03:18
Heres some odds of death in the united states.
Extacy overdose: ...................roughly 1:100,000
Hit by lightning:.......................1:55,333
Explosion:................................1:26,815
Drowning In bathtub...............1:10,564
Just a thaught.
aZnWaSiAn
-I can't stop raving...
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IzzyLightdancer
New Member
United States
46 posts
Joined: Jun, 2001
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Posted - 2001/06/26 : 22:41:40
I am all for personal freedoms. Anything that stops someone for doing anything that they want to do (that isn't hurting anyone other than them selves) is a completely unacceptable thing. If some one wants to do drugs it should be thier choice. As long as they dp them responsible and don't put them selves in a situation where others could be hurt by it.
RUle 4 - NEVER monkey with another monkey's monkey! - so sayth The Rule book of IZZY
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RUle 4 - NEVER monkey with another monkey's monkey! - so sayth The Rule book of IZZY
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BassBomb305
Starting Member
14 posts
Joined: Jun, 2001
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Posted - 2001/06/26 : 23:15:58
Hey Soren...Wow! finally someone that does some research to back up their opinions...NE-ways. Can you give me some links to the other 2 non-brain- damaging studies? I am very interested in that...From what I understood the only study done that had absolutely no brain damage was done by the MAPS organization when mdma (100mg I think) was tested along with a 20mg dose of prozac. I'd love to learn more though...I think I'm addicted to information:) And as far as everybody saying you cant enjoy music and use drugs...I can't believe that statement at all! I personally only only use occationaly on special occations...but if anything that has increased my love for music and dancing when I'm totally sober.
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dj-efeks
Senior Member
Australia
298 posts
Joined: May, 2001
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Posted - 2001/06/27 : 06:46:17
i personally dont believe that drugs are a problem at all, you can take em, have a really good time, and that be it, anything in moderation is not a problem, it is the people using the drugs that are the problem, as we all know people have problems with legal drugs as well as the illegal ones, its these peoples personalities that cause the problem, not the drugs, blaming the drugs is their easy escape, i say if ur gunna do it, know what ur getting into, be careful, and be positive, dont abuse the drugs... because they will abuse you
 ...we were taught to believe, that everyone was created equal in the masterplan...
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JoNty
New Member
25 posts
Joined: Jun, 2001
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Posted - 2001/06/27 : 07:23:09
soren, I see you`re quite clued up about it all, but there`s still a risk of dying if I get hold of some dodgy pill (U know the type, washing up powder etc), and I`m not THAT into drugs that I`ll go out and get hold of some testing kit. It all just seems like a waste of time, 4 me, seeing I don`t need drugs.
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Soren
Senior Member
United States
499 posts
Joined: Mar, 2001
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Posted - 2001/06/27 : 09:31:03
quote:
Originally posted by BassBomb305:
Hey Soren...Wow! finally someone that does some research to back up their opinions...NE-ways. Can you give me some links to the other 2 non-brain- damaging studies? I am very interested in that...From what I understood the only study done that had absolutely no brain damage was done by the MAPS organization when mdma (100mg I think) was tested along with a 20mg dose of prozac. I'd love to learn more though...I think I'm addicted to information:) And as far as everybody saying you cant enjoy music and use drugs...I can't believe that statement at all! I personally only only use occationaly on special occations...but if anything that has increased my love for music and dancing when I'm totally sober.
Hey thanks!
http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/mdma/mdma_journal.shtml
Is a link to a page with links to most of the studies done on MDMA. I went through these studies starting about 3 years ago and have updated my notes here and there with new study info so im not really sure which of those are the studies I frequently quote in my notes... Also the page layout has changed since i was last there which doesn't help. But try and look through them yourself and formulate your own opinion on things. I came to the conclusion that MDMA when done in moderate to medium doses is completetly benign, but just as I encourage everyone to not listen to the government cause they are full of crap I also would encourage you not to listen to me, but rather to formulate your own opinion on the dangers of MDMA through research. But I realize most ppls don't have the time for this type of indepth research (some basic medical knowledge also helps when reading thru the studies) so ill just say that I consider myslelf a fairly accurate/non-biased person on this topic and I try to present the facts and nothing else.
Addressing the MAPS study: MAPS didn't actually do this study, but it was sponsored by MAPS and it's founder Rick Doblin (he lives in Boston same as me and is a really cool guy). You are correct, this study showed that Prozac when taken 5-6 hours after a dose of MDMA prevented neurotoxicity. The reason being that neurotoxicity is caused by Dopamine entering your Serotonin cells through the Serotonin reuptake transporters when they are worn out (or chemically changed, this is disputed) from MDMA use. Normally Dopamine can't go into Serotonin cells, but after coming down from MDMA there is a window of about 12-24 hours where small amounts can get in. If Dopamine does get into your Serotonin cells it gets broken down by your MAO and when MAO's and Dopamine combine they turn into Hydrogen Peroxide which oxidizes your serotonin cells damaging them. Now Prozac blocks up your reuptake transporters as soon as you take it, hence if you take it right as you are coming down it blocks Dopamine from entering your serotonin cells and prevents any possible neurotoxicity.
NOTES: Is it good to take one drug that very little is know about to prevent damage from another drug? Dunno... up to you i guess. And most importantly if you don't take amazing amounts (about 3 or more pills at once) of MDMA there is evidence that your reuptakes don't get worn enough to allow any Dopamine in and hence there is no damage at all anyway....
For more info check out:
http://www.dancesafe.org/slideshow/
that should explain some of that better and more visually than i can.
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Soren
Senior Member
United States
499 posts
Joined: Mar, 2001
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Posted - 2001/06/27 : 10:04:29
DJ-Efeks: You are correct. The propensity for an addictive personallity is genetic and has nothing to do with the particualr substance. If somone became addicted to MDMA and it ruined their life then there is a 99% chance that if they never took MDMA that they would have found some other chemical (Alcohol being the most commonly abused one) and ruined their life with that instead of MDMA.
Jonty: It's good U don't need drugs. If a person ever NEEDS drugs then they have a problem and should probably seek help.
Soren's Prattling: Most of the time when a person feels that they need drugs (especially Cocaine) it's due to a lack of Dopamine in their brain or just having a really crappy life and needing to escape it. Almost all drugs increase the amount of Dopamine in your brain and if you have a Dopamine shortage your brain recognizes the increased amount as what it's supposed to be at and it tells you to keep doing whatever is causing the increase and that's when addiction occurs. There are prescription meds that can correct this Dopamine deficiency quite easily however ^_^
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silver
Admin
Japan
12,565 posts
Joined: Feb, 2001
894 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2001/06/27 : 10:58:39
Stat's don't mean anything, you can make stats look anyway you want, and you can find stats that say anything you want... trust me... drugs screw your life up.... I have watched loads of my friends waste their lives because of drugs, they turn to crime and live in really bad places, are they happy? I don't know... but they were sure really smart before they took drugs, now they are just drug freaks...
So if you are going to take drugs (I'm not recommending it) don't use stats to make your case for taking drugs. Like your mother always said, you don't just take drugs because everyone else is. For whatever reason you take drugs or plan to take drugs is your business, but don't try to convict other people into thinking it is okay, because it's not...
You like happy hardcore music and parties? Then buy vinyl records and not drugs... lasts longer and everyone can enjoy it.
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Hughes
Junior Member
United Kingdom
82 posts
Joined: Jun, 2001
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Posted - 2001/06/27 : 11:19:26
Most of my friends take drugs when going out, speed, pills, charlie whatever and sometimes even when staying in. It's just for kicks, to get them in the mood or make a better night of it. Stuff like this doesn't really appeal to me, so I don't bother.
One of my friends says;
you can't trust statistics,
you know it's wrong,
you know you are doing yourself harm,
but don't let anyone else tell you what to do, it's your own personnal preference.
You should be able to enjoy the hhc without taking anything.
Club Kinetic Ravers.
Live, Love and Dance
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Soren
Senior Member
United States
499 posts
Joined: Mar, 2001
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Posted - 2001/06/27 : 11:47:42
Silver: Ur right in saying that stats can be manipulated. That's why I want ppls to read and research themselves. But I completely disagree with ur statement that drugs mess ur life up. I believe you are implying only the illegal drugs in that satement and the pure fact of the matter is that legal drugs (alcohol, nicotine) cause way way way more damage and misery than all illegal drugs. If you say something like "illegal drugs all ruin your life" then you must first admit that legal ones are far worse and all must be made illegal. Also, I have been around drug ppls for a long time and i have taken drugs for a long time and I have seen very very few ppls getting seriously addicted and "runining" their lives. And the ppls that I have seen like this all had serious problems and if they didn't get addicted to illegal drugs they would have been addicted to legal ones. Most of my friends (me included) take illegal substances every few months and are completely in control of our use. I personally do information tech/sysop work at a children's hospital. I am also going to college and have an active social life on the side. I assure you that my life hasn't been screwed up and since i have been taking illegal drugs for about 4 years now Im pretty sure my life isn't suddenly gonna fly off the handle because of my use. In fact out of about 20 good raver friends i have all of them take drugs and have done so for a while and are in control.
I have never seen a friend "turn to crime" over drugs. I have heard loads of government adds saying this will happen to you if you even think about taking drugs, maybe you have really really bad luck with your friends or I have good luck but I assure you this is not the norm.
Statistics, facts, and research are too be used to measure out the risk factor of using illegal subsances before you try them only. After that you must use common sense, self control, and moderation to keep yourself safe. And of all the "drug friends" I have had I have only seen one person go way overboard to what I would consider unsafe levels. Normally ppls just get really into something (sometimes a bit too much) for a month or two and then get bored with it and quit....
But ive said it before and ill say it again "What the heck do I know?"
^_^
"I didn't avoid pot cause I was afraid of becoming addicted, I avoided pot cause I didn't wanna become a f&*%ing carpenter"
Edited by - soren on 27 Jun 2001 11:59:17
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Happy Hardcore makes me feel like a Koala bear just crapped a rainbow in my brain.
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BassBomb305
Starting Member
14 posts
Joined: Jun, 2001
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Posted - 2001/06/28 : 05:55:16
Hmmm...interesting topic. I always like these kind of discussions. Thanks for the links Soren...I will definately do some of my own research. I'm moving out to Boston in August...What is the scene like over there?
Edited by - BassBomb305 on 28 Jun 2001 05:57:47
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Soren
Senior Member
United States
499 posts
Joined: Mar, 2001
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Posted - 2001/06/28 : 08:34:31
Well... in Boston there isn't a scene. You have to drive 2-4 hours to get to western MA, New Hampshire, Connecticut or Maine. It's kinda stinky. ANd generally lately the parties I have gone to have been really dark with a general vibe void. Im actually looking forward to moving soon so I can start going out again...
^_^
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Happy Hardcore makes me feel like a Koala bear just crapped a rainbow in my brain.
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BassBomb305
Starting Member
14 posts
Joined: Jun, 2001
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Posted - 2001/06/28 : 22:47:19
hmmm..yeah that doesn't sound that good:( Oh well, I'm up for road-trips. That's not a problem for me. Is there any good parties going on in August? When are you moving?
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silver
Admin
Japan
12,565 posts
Joined: Feb, 2001
894 hardcore releases
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Posted - 2001/06/29 : 01:21:27
Actually road trips are half the fun, you pack all your friends into the car, you talk about what you are going to do while you are at the party, you listen to tapes you and your friends made you eat food, snacks and soda or whatever... it's fun. Just make sure that when you come back that the driver is well rested.
I remember a party in Australia where a car went off the side of a big cliff after a party and three people died, the fourth person woke up to find pieces of their friends all around him....
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